Firbush Retreats Firbush retreats are organized and led by Robert T. Walker. Firbush retreats are designed to make the best theology accessible to as many people as possible and especially those not trained in theology and often not familiar with routine technical terms. They combine times of worship and prayer with reflection on a theme related to Torrance theology. For more information see https://tftorrance.org/firbush. ----------- Firbush Retreat Summer 2015 Thomas A. Noble, "Teaching Nicene Theology Today" https://tftorrance.org/firbushS2015 The audio recording for this presentation is available on the Firbush Retreat section of the website for the Thomas F. Torrance Theological Fellowship. The following AI transcript is too rough to rely upon, but perhaps useful for word searches and time-stamps. It is unretouched; if anyone wishes to listen to it and clean it up we will be happy to post an improved version (contact the webmasters). We invite speakers to send us slides for their talks, which we will post alongside the audios and transcripts. If any speaker wishes to have their talk removed from the website, just let us know and we'll take down both the audio and the transcript. ------------ 00:00-00:05 It's 40 years of my business, for almost 40 years, to be teaching theology. 00:05-00:10 So I think this title, Teaching Nicene Theology Today, I hope is of interest to everybody. 00:10-00:18 And I look forward to the discussion because parish ministers, lay people, local preachers and so on, 00:18-00:21 this is surely all an area of interest. 00:21-00:26 What is the structure of the education that our ministers go through? 00:26-00:31 And so that's what I have been asked to look at. 00:31-00:34 So, three C's. 00:34-00:36 Briefly, context. 00:36-00:38 Secondly, curriculum. 00:38-00:41 And thirdly, content. 00:41-00:47 So under content, I beg your pardon, starting with context. 00:47-00:55 Under context, just a little bit more about my personal context, since that is relevant. 00:55-00:57 As I say, I've been teaching theology for the last 40 years. 00:57-01:05 When we graduated in 1976, I went straight to the Nazarene College in Didsbury and taught there for 20 years, 01:05-01:06 Didsbury in Manchester. 01:06-01:11 And then I was asked to go to the Nazarene Theological Seminary in Kansas City, Missouri. 01:11-01:17 And I've been travelling back and forward teaching there for almost 20 years. 01:17-01:24 Now, the context there, therefore, is a little different from the context we're looking at in Scotland, for two reasons. 01:24-01:31 One, it's not the reformed Presbyterian tradition, it's the Wesleyan tradition, an evangelical Wesleyan tradition, 01:31-01:33 an offshoot from Methodism. 01:33-01:40 The Church of the Nazarene is rapidly growing around the world, 2 million members, 195 countries, 53 colleges. 01:40-01:44 Not growing in this country, I'm afraid. 01:44-01:50 But that is the context within which I taught at the college in Manchester. 01:50-01:59 And what is of the relevant difference here, of course, is that these are explicitly confessional colleges, not state colleges. 01:59-02:04 So there isn't the link with universities that there is in the Scottish scene. 02:04-02:06 There are disadvantages to that. 02:06-02:12 It would be too easy for us to become isolated from the general intellectual life. 02:12-02:22 But there are also advantages in that you don't have the complex situation where you have a church college in with a divinity faculty. 02:22-02:29 Everyone there is and has to be a committed member of the church. 02:29-02:34 And there are advantages both ways in preparing people for the ministry. 02:34-02:41 But bear that in mind as I talk about the curriculum and the context. 02:41-02:44 Well, the curriculum. 02:44-02:47 This is the first part, the first page there. 02:47-02:53 I want just to briefly outline a paper I prepared 14, 15, 11 years ago. 02:53-03:03 Rather, after I went to Kansas City in 96, a few years later, I was asked to become director of the MDiv degree. 03:03-03:11 Now, Americans could never work out why a BD was a second degree because a bachelor's degree is a first degree. 03:11-03:16 And so 40 years ago or so, they changed the title to Master of Divinity. 03:16-03:17 So that's the MDiv course. 03:17-03:18 And I was director of that. 03:18-03:21 And we went through curriculum revision. 03:21-03:27 And if you can imagine all these academics sitting together trying to agree on what they're going to do, 03:27-03:33 it's a nightmare really to pull them together and get agreement on the curriculum. 03:33-03:36 So I thought this essay would help. 03:36-03:39 What are we actually doing in a theological seminary? 03:39-03:43 Of course, a little footnote, only the Catholics talk about seminaries in this country. 03:43-03:51 Every denomination has its seminaries in the states, which are graduate level institutions. 03:51-03:58 Well, I started off with a book by Edward Farley, distinguished professor at Vanderbilt, 03:58-04:06 large Methodist university in Nashville, Tennessee, who, by the way, incidentally died just last December there. 04:06-04:13 And Edward Farley in his book Theologia, Fragmentation of Unity of Theological Education, 04:13-04:23 was talking about the way in which the curriculum seemed to becoming divided and more and more disciplines crowding into it. 04:23-04:36 Now, those of you who have done theological education in this country will recall that basically there are four theological disciplines that have traditionally been taught for the last 200 years. 04:36-04:42 Theology, systematic theology, which include both dogmatics and philosophical theology, 04:42-04:52 biblical studies, which of course divides into Old Testament and New Testament, church history and practical or pastoral theology. 04:52-05:00 One of the interesting features of the last 20, 30 years or so is that pastoral practical theology has grown. 05:00-05:07 So whereas when I was a student at New College, one sixth of the academic staff were in practical theology, 05:07-05:11 where I teach now, one half are concerned with practical theology. 05:11-05:16 And there's a lot of social science influence there, sociology, psychology. 05:16-05:24 There are new disciplines like missiology. A lot more is done with spiritual formation, pastoral counseling. 05:24-05:32 All of that has ballooned even in explicitly Christian colleges. 05:32-05:42 The other change, of course, in the Scottish scene and in the British university scene is that since we are a de facto secular society, 05:42-05:49 although perhaps a de jure Christian one, religious studies has become a big feature. 05:49-05:56 The first religious studies teacher arrived at New College at the same time as we did, Dr. Frank Quailey. 05:56-06:02 But that has since grown enormously. And so that you now have professors of Islamic studies and so on. 06:02-06:13 We don't have that. We are a church college. But in the college at Manchester, we have recently developed a department of Islamic studies. 06:13-06:24 Now that's more a branch of missiology. That's more the question of how do Christians relate to, befriend, present Christ to the Islamic world. 06:24-06:31 But of course, in the Scottish or in the secular university situation, it's a much more neutral study. 06:31-06:37 It is what I would classify as a kind of social science rather than strictly theology. 06:37-06:46 However, the institutions I've been in have been Christian colleges and so we still have that fourfold division. 06:46-06:53 But the question which Farley posed was, well, what is the unity between these different traditions? 06:53-07:01 I thought I would speak quite quickly on this, but I see I'm going on too long, so I better put that there. 07:01-07:08 How are these actually unified? What is the unity at least in these four? 07:08-07:17 Well, Farley suggested that the key to the unity lay in theologia. What is theology? 07:17-07:24 But Farley, it seemed to me, never brought together the subjective dimension. 07:24-07:36 That is that theology was the development of the spiritual life and understanding and service abilities of the minister with the objective dimension. 07:36-07:41 That is theology as a genuine knowledge of God. 07:41-07:47 But his whole focus was on how to develop the personal spiritual characteristics and the danger of that, 07:47-07:54 of course, from my perspective, having studied with T.F. Torrance, was the danger of anthropocentrism. 07:54-08:01 That the whole concentration was how I am developing as a minister, how I am developing as a spiritually mature person, 08:01-08:13 rather than focusing and circling the whole of the theological preparation around who God is and what God has done in Jesus Christ. 08:13-08:23 I mentioned Jerome K. Bruner there, who was an educationalist when I studied education, become a high school teacher. 08:23-08:31 Bruner makes this point that we do not teach them mathematics, we teach them to be mathematicians. 08:31-08:33 We do not teach them history, we teach them to be historians. 08:33-08:40 So similarly, if you take that into theology, we're not just giving people facts and information to mug up. 08:40-08:51 We are shaping minds so that they are theologians and not necessarily academic theologians, of course, but proclaiming the word of God. 08:51-09:05 So I suggested to my colleagues that T.F. Torrance's concept of what theology was gave us a superb grounding for how we understand the theological curriculum. 09:05-09:11 If we don't know what theology is, how can we devise a curriculum? 09:11-09:23 So theological science and the emphasis that theology is the science of God, I suggested, should be the center of our understanding. 09:23-09:26 So three points arising out of that. 09:26-09:31 The first point that Christians actually claim to know this God. 09:31-09:38 In other words, there is a cognitive dimension necessarily to theology. 09:38-09:49 Now, those were the days, late 1990s, 2000, when a movement called post-liberalism was the latest fashion in America. 09:49-10:01 And part of the idea of that movement, Hans Frei, George Lindbeck, and however vast, was to focus on the language we use for talking about God. 10:01-10:06 So theology was about God's talk, how you spoke about God. 10:06-10:11 In contrast, I wanted to claim that that's not enough. 10:11-10:21 That we don't just examine the language we use about God, but that when we use this language, when we speak of God, we are actually making truth claims. 10:21-10:26 We are actually claiming, inevitably Christians are claiming, that we know God. 10:26-10:28 Read John, read Paul. 10:28-10:39 The language of knowing God occurs regularly and is integral to the whole understanding of what Christians do. 10:39-10:47 Arising out of that, number two, secondly, this knowledge is not merely abstract knowledge of facts or principles or doctrines or truths. 10:47-10:51 It is a personal knowledge of a personal God. 10:51-10:56 And of course, there Michael Polanyi and T.F. Torrance moved in parallel. 10:56-11:12 He is a scientist and he gives his lectures personal knowledge and the emphasis that it is a myth that science is totally objective and detached. 11:12-11:23 That all knowledge, all science has an objective pole, that which is known, and a subjective pole, the person who does the knowing. 11:23-11:29 And so, it is not the case that religion and theology is a lot of subjectivity and science is a lot of objectivity. 11:29-11:33 They're both simultaneously objective and subjective. 11:33-11:38 But the focus has to be on the objective pole, our knowledge of God. 11:38-11:48 And also the emphasis in T.F., of course, that it's not just our individualistic knowledge of God, it's our corporate knowledge as the Church of Jesus Christ. 11:48-11:51 But of course, that knowledge is totally dependent on God's revelation. 11:51-11:55 We know God as he reveals himself. 11:55-12:04 So, it's not because of our cleverness, it's not because of our insight, our academic ability, our advanced culture. 12:04-12:12 The triune God gives himself to be known in his word by his Spirit. 12:12-12:15 So, God is not a datum within the world. 12:15-12:17 We can't turn a corner and bump into him. 12:17-12:24 We only come to know him because of the focus of his revelation in Jesus Christ, the Word made flesh. 12:24-12:29 And even then, no one can call Jesus Lord but by the Holy Spirit. 12:29-12:31 So, it's inherently Trinitarian. 12:31-12:37 So, it's not just abstractive knowledge, it is personal knowledge of the triune God. 12:37-12:44 But that, Torrance argued, is fully scientific because you know anything in accordance with its nature. 12:44-12:47 And so, the nature of God is to be the tri-personal God. 12:47-12:52 So, it is fully cognitive, it is fully scientific that we claim to know God. 12:52-12:53 Now, there are those who dismiss that. 12:53-12:57 They dismiss the existence of God and therefore they think we're talking nonsense. 12:57-12:59 Well, that's their business. 12:59-13:09 From the Christian point of view, if we believe in God at all, we have to claim that this is an object of science, although there is also a subjective pole. 13:09-13:17 Now, that was a somewhat different tack, perhaps, from what my colleagues were used to. 13:17-13:31 Because it is true of my own Wesleyan tradition, as it is of many evangelical traditions, that we can become so focused on, to paraphrase James Torrance, 13:31-13:39 so focused on my experience of God that we fail to focus on the God whom we experience. 13:39-13:52 So, it was a kind of taking this great concern with piety and holiness and so on and saying, "But actually, unless you're centered in God, there is no valid human piety or human holiness. 13:52-13:55 We mustn't become self-centered about this." 13:55-14:03 So, the triune God is known only by his word, by his spirit, but the word is both verbal and personal. 14:03-14:05 It's not an either/or. 14:05-14:09 So, there is the kurugma, the proclamation, the prophets and apostles. 14:09-14:27 There is a verbal, linguistic, conceptual dimension given in the models and metaphors of the revelation, priest, sacrifice, king, all of these biblically given models and metaphors which give us the words. 14:27-14:33 But these are not merely truths, not abstractions or disembodied commandments that we are concerned with. 14:33-14:38 It is the God who reveals himself in Jesus Christ through the preaching of the gospel. 14:38-14:40 Christ clothed with his gospel. 14:40-14:46 TF was always quoting Calvin with that marvelous phrase. 14:46-14:50 This is only known by the spirit, by being born anew. 14:50-14:58 And so, it is not only informative but performative and not only performative but transformative. 14:58-15:08 And from my education studies, Piaget comes to mind and his idea that as the mind assimilates new knowledge, there is an accommodation. 15:08-15:09 The mind grows. 15:09-15:12 The mind of the child changes. 15:12-15:26 And so, as God speaks to us and his truth is communicated to us, so there is spiritual formation and transformation taking place in the Christian. 15:26-15:48 What this clearly pictures for us is that theological education as spiritual and personal formation is in fact a transformation which takes place as we focus our lives and our understanding not on what is going on in here but objectively on the word by the spirit. 15:48-16:07 So, with that very brief outline of what I saw as the significant points arising from Torrance's understanding of what theology is, what then were the implications for the formation of the theological curriculum? 16:07-16:10 Well, I drew out five there. 16:10-16:14 And of course, here I'm talking about across the theological curriculum. 16:14-16:37 So, think of those four basic disciplines, although of course biblical studies is twofold, Old Testament, New Testament, theological studies, philosophical theology and dogmatic theology, giving you the six departments which we used to have at New College. 16:37-16:39 Well, what are the implications across this? 16:39-16:44 And remember a lot of my colleagues are into practical theology. 16:44-16:58 They had never quite met this understanding of theology and quite a few of them, their major qualifications were in the social sciences, psychology and so on. 16:58-17:02 So, in a way, this was new thinking for them. 17:02-17:07 But the implications for our curriculum and I outlined five. 17:07-17:15 First of all, that our theological education must center in the worship of the triune God. 17:15-17:41 But if Christian theology is truly the articulation of our knowledge of God and not just of our abstract theoretical knowledge about God, then our theology of worship embodied in the way we worship in our chapel services and prayer times should be at the heart of our curriculum. 17:41-17:51 I seem to remember actually arguing therefore that we should make chapel services as compulsory as class attendance, but they weren't going to wear that. 17:51-17:55 That was all right for undergraduates but not for these mature graduate students. 17:55-18:11 Since knowledge of God comes to us through Holy Scriptures, consecutive reading of the narrative of Holy Scripture in a planned lectionary and its accompanying exposition and responding prayer and praise to God for his word to us should be at the heart of our life as a theological community. 18:11-18:11 I argued. 18:11-18:24 So what happens in class should arise out of what happens in our worship services as seminary community together. 18:24-18:30 So our theological education must be centered in the worship of the triune God. 18:30-18:36 This question of prayer before class, both the terms is, of course, used to do that. 18:36-18:39 One or two other people, as I recall when I was a student. 18:39-18:44 I don't remember it ever happening in church history. 18:44-18:47 I remember George Anderson used to pray before Old Testament lectures. 18:47-18:50 I don't think any other members of the department did. 18:50-18:53 Nobody prayed in the New Testament department. 18:53-18:57 And I didn't actually take practical theology, so I don't know what happened there. 18:57-19:01 Presumably they were the best at praying. 19:01-19:07 But who knows? 19:07-19:17 Well, second comment, and of course you see how these five implications are arising out of the shape of the fourfold curriculum, 19:17-19:21 that our theological education must give primacy to the study of Holy Scripture. 19:21-19:25 And of course, the Old Testament, New Testament people would say amen to that. 19:25-19:34 If the church lives out of every word that proceeds from the mouth of God, then the study of Holy Scripture should be thorough and comprehensive. 19:34-19:42 I argue that that should have primacy in the sense that everything else in the curriculum should arise out of the narrative of God's mighty acts. 19:42-19:48 So that systematic theology, I wrote then, needs to allow itself to be shaped by biblical theology. 19:48-20:01 I'm not quite sure I would write that same now, because I've increasingly come to realise the importance of the rule of faith, 20:01-20:05 which you have expounded in TF, and the creed. 20:05-20:12 And I'm sort of currently developing the thesis that the shape of the creed is the shape of the gospel. 20:12-20:23 And therefore, the creed, i.e. the gospel, should be the major factor in our hermeneutic, in our interpretation of Holy Scripture. 20:23-20:28 That the gospel is centred in Christ crucified and risen. 20:28-20:34 The parabolic shape of Philippians 2 is the shape of the second article of the creed. 20:34-20:39 But the gospel also is that the Father sent the Son, and the Father and Son sent the Spirit. 20:39-20:42 So there you have the Trinitarian shape of the gospel. 20:42-20:45 So I think I would put that slightly differently today. 20:45-20:56 And to choose some abstract theme out of Scripture, rather than the gospel, as the basic hermeneutic, I think I would disagree with now. 20:56-21:02 Spiritual formation, all areas of practical or pastoral theology, need to be in continual conversation with biblical scholarship, 21:02-21:07 and accountable to biblical scholarship for the appropriateness of the paradigms and models they work with. 21:07-21:13 And to some extent, I was working there against the strong influence of the social science agenda. 21:13-21:19 Now, I'm not against the social sciences. I did social science in my first degree. 21:19-21:30 But where it comes into practical theology, I think it has to be reformed, reshaped, in the light of the gospel and in the light of theology. 21:30-21:35 So that was the second implication. 21:35-21:43 Third, our theological education must encourage deep and reflective meditation on Christian history. 21:43-21:48 Now, of course, church history can be pursued as a purely secular discipline. 21:48-21:55 And there are those, I think, within the divinity faculties and schools who would argue that that is what we must do. 21:55-22:10 And there's a certain amount of truth in that, because when we come to study history as historians, we do develop, we do use a certain methodological secularism. 22:10-22:14 So when I'm teaching the history of the Second World War, I don't bring God into it. 22:14-22:22 But I'm teaching the causes of the First World War, I don't bring God into it. So the historian does work with a methodological secularism. 22:22-22:29 So in a sense, there's something to be said that when we study church history, that is part of the method. 22:29-22:34 But of course, of Christians, you cannot leave it there because we cannot accept a metaphysical secularism. 22:34-22:43 And therefore, behind it all, we do see the hand of God. Now, we've got to be careful about that. 22:43-22:54 I think in the past, church history has been taught seeing with the view that God favored our particular tradition at such and such a time. 22:54-23:01 So if you are teaching it as a Presbyterian, you favor the covenant, or if you're preaching it as an Anglican, you've got another view of the late 17th century. 23:01-23:18 So at that point, I think we need to be more careful. But nonetheless, as Christians, the very practical business of the church as an institution in history 23:18-23:32 and the decisions it must make only can bring us sapientia, spiritual wisdom, as we reflect on them with spiritual eyes. 23:32-23:45 So perhaps you might say that's a second stage. But church history, deep and reflective meditation on Christian history from a Christian point of view, 23:45-24:05 I think is very valuable and important. In that respect, one incident in church history that I truly found shocking and still do was not so much the way... 24:05-24:09 Well, it is, of course, shocking that martyrs were burned at the stake. That is shocking on the very hand. 24:09-24:27 But what really brought me up, I remember coming across the event in Zurich when Zwingli and the Reformers, not Zwingli personally, but the Reformers in the Zwingli church drowned the Baptists, 24:27-24:37 the Anabaptists, as a punishment for daring to rebaptize adult believers. 24:37-24:47 Now, I can't quite get over the shock. These were Reform, evangelical Christians who believed in the authority of the Bible. What was going on there? 24:47-24:58 Now, that's the kind of incident in church history that can really make you think. How do we approach this as Christians and not just as secular historians? 24:58-25:10 Well, D, our theological education must deepen our knowledge of God and of ourselves. 25:10-25:20 So, Christian theology is not systematic theology in the sense that it is the study of the Christian system, simply. 25:20-25:29 That would be a study of ideas, theories, doctrines, a merely scholastic academic study, academic in the worst sense of the word. 25:29-25:43 And in my classes, I always use the working definition, theology is the articulation of our knowledge of God, not just of doctrines, not just of systematic theology, not just of abstract ideas, 25:43-25:59 but the articulation of our knowledge of God. And that it's only within the context of our relationship with the Triune God in his word, by his Spirit, that we can come to a true Christian knowledge of ourselves. 25:59-26:11 Now, as I've suggested, I think one of the dangers of some of our evangelical traditions, including our Wesleyan one, is that we can too easily focus on our own faith, our own piety, our own holiness, 26:11-26:22 how we're progressing in the Christian life. So, I have a certain suspicion of Christian formation, the danger is that it becomes an anthropocentric study. 26:22-26:35 But, within the context of our knowledge of God, we do come to a deeper understanding of ourselves. And within that context, it is healthy. 26:35-26:41 Within that context, it is reformative and transformative. 26:41-26:53 And so, many of the struggles we have and the temptations we face and the tragedies that we go through and all the issues that we were talking about this morning, 26:53-27:07 fear and guilt and shame and insecurity and so on, yes, the gospel has to speak to those things, to minister to real people in real situations where they are. 27:07-27:18 But, as a theologian, I would want to say that that has to only take place as a reflection of our knowledge of God. 27:18-27:26 So, that is why Christian theology must be centered on the God who has revealed himself definitively in Jesus Christ, 27:26-27:35 so that our knowledge of salvation comes out of our knowledge of him and our knowledge of how we participate in that salvation, 27:35-27:43 justification, sanctification, all the benefits of the atonement comes out of our knowledge of him. 27:43-27:54 Now, I added that does not mean that we can ignore the knowledge that comes to us in the human sciences, for the word did become flesh. 27:54-27:59 And flesh is that humanity which we are. 27:59-28:09 But once again, those secular sciences, in addition to biblical criticism and history, have to be baptized into Christ. 28:09-28:19 That is to say, they have to understand that true knowledge of ourselves is not the knowledge of our sinful selves belonging to this age, 28:19-28:30 katazarka, according to the flesh, but that in the paradoxical already but not yet structure of New Testament Christian thinking, 28:30-28:37 we must come to know ourselves in Christ, katapneuma, according to the spirit. 28:37-28:45 Now, that is beyond the terms of reference of the secular human sciences, but it must not be beyond the thinking of the Christian social science. 28:45-28:53 So once again, as with history, there is a secular methodology, so with the social sciences, but as Christians reflect on that and use it, 28:53-28:56 it has to be baptized into Christ. 28:56-29:05 So psychology is obviously of enormous help and advantage in developing skills of pastoral counseling. 29:05-29:11 But in the end of the day, our knowledge of who we are is not taken from the secular science of psychology. 29:11-29:15 It's taken from the word of God. 29:15-29:24 And fifthly, our theological education must be an inseparable unity of theoria and praxis, theory and practice. 29:24-29:31 And here we have to resist the kind of Hellenistic dualism that puts theory up here and practice down here. 29:31-29:38 And sometimes a discussion you would hear people saying, oh, but that's just your theological theory. 29:38-29:40 What happens in practice is. 29:40-29:43 Well, that's disastrous thinking. 29:43-29:49 That is the great Hellenistic dualism that T.F. was so often proclaiming against. 29:49-29:53 These two have to be integrated. 29:53-30:03 And so I comment that for the Christian fathers, theoria was not the Platerist or Platonic contemplation of eternal abstract ideas. 30:03-30:06 That would be a static and inert kind of theoria. 30:06-30:09 Rather, it means the vision of God. 30:09-30:13 Focus on the living God. 30:13-30:17 And therefore, since he is the God who acts. 30:17-30:25 Christian contemplation and meditation and prayer is indivisible from Christian practice. 30:25-30:35 And somehow this inseparability, therefore, of theoria, the vision of God and praxis, the practice of ministry. 30:35-30:46 For a Christian college or seminary must be united and that must be embodied in the way we shape our curriculum so that our classes, 30:46-30:58 which focus on knowledge of God through the scriptures, must be integrally related to our pastoral, evangelistic, educational missionary service. 30:58-31:03 So those were the principles that I drew out of that. 31:03-31:10 Was I successful? To a minor degree, I think. 31:10-31:15 But I think in the end of the day, there was a backward step after I'd ceased to be involved in that. 31:15-31:18 But I won't go into that. Right. 31:18-31:22 Well, that's the curriculum. How am I doing for time? 31:22-31:25 We have 12 minutes before quarter to seven. 31:25-31:28 Bob has ultimate referee. We can go on a little bit longer. 31:28-31:31 And we finish at quarter to seven. Yes. OK. 31:31-31:43 Right. Well, maybe I've said enough. And what I have given you after that for your interest is an outline of the syllabi in which that was the content thing. 31:43-31:48 And that may be of interest and some folks might like to ask questions on that later. 31:48-31:50 But let's stop. Let me stop there. Give time for questions. 31:50-31:57 Well, thank you very much indeed. 31:57-31:58 David.